US/Canada Retirement Benefits & OAS in Canada - ask
Hi David, One of my colleagues at work has referred me your name for consultation regarding US/Canada retirement benefits & OAS in Canada. I became Canadian resident in Apr. 73 & have worked from May 74 to Dec. 97. Then moved to US in Dec. 97 & became Canadian non-resident in Dec. 98. Currently I am a Canadian Citizen & a US resident. Within next few years, I am planning to retire once I satisfy the 40 points requirement in the US for Social Security benefits. When the time comes, I would like to have a personal meeting with you & discuss the strategy. In the meantime, I would like to know if there are any residency requirements which I need to satisfy for both, Canada & US so that I can qualify for maximum OAS & CPP benefits in Canada and the Social Security benefits in US. Please let me know about your Consultation charges i.e. per visit/per hr etc. Please also send me your contact Phone #. Thanks, ===================================== david ingram replies: To collect the maximum CPP, you have to have worked in Canada at maximum rates for 40 years by age 70. To collect the maximum OAS, you have to have "lived - not worked" in Canada for 40 years after turning 18. I charge a minimum of $400 / hour Canadian for phone or personal consultations. As a rule, if one calls back for a couple of minutes at another time because of something that was not clear from the original, I do not charge for the 2 or 3 minute call. If you do not qualify for the full amounts, they will be pro-rated by the number of years you have worked or been here. The following is a corrected answer to a question from last January. It might give you some other ideas The original Q & A is at the bottom of the email. ----- Original Message ----- From: centapede at lists.centa.com To: CENTAPEDE Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 2:20 AM Subject: Canadian asks about CPP & OAS - a cross-border International real estate rental mutual funds immigration non-resident income tax expert - David Ingram 's CEN-TA Services in North Vancouver BC Canada on It's Your Money CKBD AM600 Fred Snyder The following is a correction to my answer. Quite frankly, I did not recognize that you could use time paid into US Social Security to qualify for the 20 year provision to collect Canadian OAS in the US. And Frank Norman also wrote to make sure that my audience recognized that although I was correct about using CPP_ credits to qualify for US Social Security, it is only the credits that qualify you for the pension based upon the time you actually paid into US social security and that the "MONEY" paid into the CPP does not have any affect on the amount of the US Social Security. Thank you Frank and Andrew. Anyone in this position can read the whole agreement that I referred to in Andrews reference below. It is the same agreement but i just did not recognize the actual implementation. I ALWAYS give credit when corrected. david ingram -----Original Message----- From: Nelson, Andrew G. [mailto:agnelson at cal.ameren.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2005 8:51 AM To: taxman at centa.com Subject: RE: Canadian asks about CPP & OAS - a cross-border International real estate rental mutual funds immigration non-resident income tax expert - David Ingram 's CEN-TA Services in North Vancouver BC Canada on It's Your Money CKBD AM600 Fred Snyder Sure do. http://www.ssa.gov/international/Agreement_Pamphlets/canada.html The relevant section: IV.A.2. Benefits from Canada Canada provides retirement, survivors and disability benefits through two separate programs. Old-Age Security (OAS) Program To get OAS benefits, you must be 65 or older and must have been a resident of Canada for at least 10 years after age 18 (or 20 years after age 18 to have benefits paid outside Canada). Under the agreement, Canada will consider your U.S. Social Security credits earned after 1951 and after age 18, along with periods of residence in Canada after 1951 and after age 18, to meet the OAS residence requirements. However, to be eligible to have your U.S. credits counted, you must have resided in Canada for at least one year after 1951 and after age 18. In other words, for benefits to be paid outside Canada for longer than 6 months, one needs 20 years of residency. The agreement states that US SS quarters can be used to make up that residency requirement. I'm helping a woman right now to get her OAS who has lived 40 years in US, but had 10 years after age 18 and after 1951. It will only be a quarter (10/40ths) of what you will get, but its free money. Similar wording is found in the Cdn website: http://www.sdc.gc.ca/en/isp/pub/ibfa/usa-i.shtml http://www.sdc.gc.ca/en/isp/ibfa/countries/agreements/usa-a.shtml Article IX 3 a) an Old Age Security pension shall be paid to a person who is outside Canada only if that person's periods of residence, totalized as provided in Article VIII, are at least equal to the minimum period of residence in Canada required by the Old Age Security Act for entitlement to the payment of a pension outside Canada; and ... [bold mine showing that this residency period can be totalized] -----Original Message----- From: David Ingram [mailto:taxman at centa.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2005 10:26 AM To: Nelson, Andrew G. Subject: RE: Canadian asks about CPP & OAS - a cross-border International real estate rental mutual funds immigration non-resident income tax expert - David Ingram 's CEN-TA Services in North Vancouver BC Canada on It's Your Money CKBD AM600 Fred Snyd Andrew - are you sure of this? I don't work with OAS, CPP and SS much but I know that a couple of clients have had their OAS cancelled and would have qualified under your rules. I have just taken another look and do not see it easily. Do you have an article or reference I can read. david -----Original Message----- From: Nelson, Andrew G. [mailto:agnelson at cal.ameren.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2005 6:35 AM To: taxman at centa.com; centapede at lists.centa.com Subject: RE: Canadian asks about CPP & OAS - a cross-border International real estate rental mutual funds immigration non-resident income tax expert - David Ingram 's CEN-TA Services in North Vancouver BC Canada on It's Your Money CKBD AM600 Fred Snyd David, The totalization agreement between US and Canada allows quarters earned in US to count towards the 20 year requirement to be able to collect OAS outside Canada. So in this example, if one contributes 28 quarters to SS, they will be entitled to collect 13/40ths of normal OAS, paid to them forever, outside Canada. -----Original Message----- From: centapede-bounces at lists.centa.com [mailto:centapede-bounces at lists.centa.com] On Behalf Of centapede at lists.centa.com Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2005 2:02 AM To: CENTAPEDE Cc: Webmaster at Jurock. Com Subject: Canadian asks about CPP & OAS - a cross-border International real estate rental mutual funds immigration non-resident income tax expert - David Ingram 's CEN-TA Services in North Vancouver BC Canada on It's Your Money CKBD AM600 Fred Snyder's To: taxman at centa.com Subject: I have a few questions David, I have a few questions I would like to ask you. First, Pension I read that it's possible to top up your pension years if your short so it's possible to get full pension. I lived in Canada for 13 years from age 18. is it worth while to pay up my cpp for 7 years so I can get full pension 65 ? I now live in the us with over 10 years of pension earnings so I will get full pension here. Would I be paid two pensions by paying up my cpp ? Second, I believe I may own rev can some money from 12 yrs ago do I need to worry about it ? I think I read about rev can having some amnesty programme. I don't think I will ever live in Canada again as a tax resident. I may visit for a few months. In fact I'm considering leaving here (usa) for some cheap warm year round location at retirement time. Thanks, =============================== david ingram replies: If you are not living in Canada or working out of the country for a Canadian Company, there is no way to top up your CPP or OAS. If you you have not lived in Canada for 20 years after turning 18, you can NOT collect your OAS out of the country You WILL get a small CPP pension based upon your 13 years in Canada no matter where you live. You WILL get a small US Social Security Pension based upon your contributions no matter where you live. Rev Canada will not have forgiven your debt. Just today, I received a notice for an 88 year old man on old age pension. The CRA (old Revenue Canada) is trying to collect $1,800 for 1987. That is a 17 year old debt and he did not know that he owed them anything. However, we filed a 2003 return to get his a tax credit and the CRA grabbed the tax credit and sent him a bill. hopAnswers to this and other similar questions can be obtained free on Air every Sunday morning. Every Sunday at 9:00 AM on 600AM in Vancouver, Fred Snyder of Dundee Wealth Management and I, David Ingram will be hosting an INFOMERCIAL but LIVE talk show called "ITS YOUR MONEY" Those outside of the Lower Mainland will be able to listen on the internet at www.600AM.com Local calls are taken at (604) 280-0600 and Long Distance calls are taken at 1( 866) 778-0600 I do not know how far the LD line reaches.=========================================This from "ask an income tax and immigration expert" from www.centa.com or www.jurock.com or www.featureweb.com. David Ingram deals on a daily basis with expatriate tax returns with:multi jurisdictional cross and trans border expatriate problems for the United States, Canada, Mexico, Great Britain, the United Kingdom, Kuwait, Dubai, Saudi Arabia, Thailand, Indonesia, Japan, China, New Zealand, France, Germany, Spain, Italy, Russia, Georgia, Brazil, Peru, Ecuador, Bolivia, Scotland, Ireland, Hawaii, Florida, Montana, Morocco, Israel, Iraq, Iran, India, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Mali, Bangkok, Greenland, Iceland, Cuba, Bahamas, Bermuda, Barbados, St Vincent, Grenada,, Virgin Islands, US, UK, GB, and any of the 43 states with state tax returns, etc. Rockwall, Dallas, San Antonio and Houston TexasDenmark, Finland, Sweden Norway Bulgaria Croatia Income Tax and Immigration Tips, Income Tax and ImmigrationWizard Income Tax and Immigration Guru Income Tax and Immigration Consultant Income Tax and Immigration Specialist Section 216(4) 216(1) NR6 NR-6 NR 6 Non-Resident Real Estate tax specialist expert preparer consultant expatriate anti money laundering money seasoning FINTRAC E677 E667 4789 4790 TDF-90 Reporting $10,000 cross border transactions========================= Alaska, Alabama, Arkansas, Arizona, California, Colorado, Connecticut, Delaware, District of Columbia, Florida, Garland, Georgia, Hawaii, Idaho, Illinois,Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, Oregon. 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Nothing in this message is or should be construed as advice in any particular circumstances. No contract exists between the reader and the author and any and all non-contractual duties are expressly denied. All readers should obtain formal advice from a competent and appropriately qualified legal practitioner or tax specialist in connection with personal or business affairs such as at www.centa.com. If you forward this message, this disclaimer must be included." Be ALERT, the world needs more "lerts"============================== e this helps.
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